Parish Council outline their views on parking

I take objection to Councillor Williamson's comments about people who "complain and bitch" on alderleyedge.com. The website has the facility to add comments to articles, which a considerable number of people have utilised to discuss the parking issue; an issue which most people felt was not being acted upon, despite being raised last year following the publication of the Cheshire East Residents' Parking Scheme. The website acts as a discussion forum and has been used as such. Why should people affected by the news items highlighted on the website not be allowed to respond to them and why is it unreasonable to suggest the Parish Councillors might respond to the issues raised by the respondees? The parking issue is an emotive one and the brick walls which have been hit upon in trying to obtain a resolution to it have frustrated everyone concerned.

The implication from Councillor Williamson's comments is that the residents are happy to discuss the issue on a website but not bother themselves to attend meetings to effect a change. I can assure anyone who has not been involved in the process that this is not the case. Two residents of the streets in question (not including me) began work on a comprehensive and very well thought out proposal in February 2010 after consultation of all residents in the affected streets and dialogue with relevant parties. This proposal was presented to the Parish Council later in the year. Whilst I did not attend last night's meeting as I was working away, I have previously attended two Parish Council meetings, along with a significant number of other residents, to discuss the issue of residents' parking. In the most recent of the two meetings, the attendees established that Councillor Williamson had not read the residents' parking proposal which we were there to discuss. I cannot speak for other residents and why they did not attend, however based on the outcome of previous meetings, they could be forgiven for thinking their attendance last night would be futile. The speed of action has been disappointing to say the least and the discussion on the website at least appears to have triggered the beginning of some progress, whatever that may be.

Finally, I do not understand what relevance the comments regarding the legal right of a resident to park outside his or her house have. We are all aware that we do not have a legal right to park outside our houses, we have never suggested otherwise and we are not trying to change the law. We are simply trying to introduce a residents' parking scheme, the purpose of which (taken directly from http://www.cheshireeast.gov.uk) is stated below:

The purpose of residents parking schemes
In many areas it is difficult for residents to park, due to long term parking by commuters, shoppers and tourists. The purpose of the scheme is to stop this and allow the spaces to be used mainly for the benefit of residents

I have to say that I am sure Mike never put matters in quite such intemperate, unprofessional and politically foolish terms.

Newsy people always like a story - Vicar in Topless Model Bid - really means that a member of the clergy sought to buy a small replica of the Venus de Milo at auction :))))

I have returned this evening from a meeting of Wilmslow residents with James Howard and Rod Menlove in respect of a Resident's Parking Scheme for a street near to Wilmslow Station where the problem parking is that of rail commuters. From this I drew a number of interesting points.

1. The preliminary vote on whether to draft a traffic order and advertise a scheme will be carried out amongst the residents who live within the scheme boundaries. There does not appear to be an initial wide consultation with those who might find themselves the recipients of displaced parking - their chance comes when the initial traffic order has been drafted and published.

2. Rod stated his purpose as being to provide residents' parking schemes where the was strong public demand for them and a clear need. ( I hope I have reflected his comments fairly )

3. Schemes that are simple to sign and implement are preferred over those that require lots of road paint and signs. It seems to me that for Lydiat Lane and Carlisle Street - the really easy solution is to make the whole small network, including Netherfields, a residents parking zone - it would simply require signs at the end of Carlisle St and Lydiat Lane - much the same as the Wilmslow scheme that was discussed tonight.

4. I was pleased to note that Wilmslow has a brand spanking new Parish Council that appears to have been fully behind their residents in taking their scheme forwards.

I can only hope that we see the problem streets of Alderley Edge resolved in the same positive and pleasant manner as happened this evening for some Wilmslow streets.

Several residents did consider attending the meeting but Catriona was right in suggesting that, based on previous experiences, our attendance would be futile.
For Councillor Williams to dismiss the expressed genuine concerns and issues as "Complain and bitch", demonstrates his lack of respect for the responsble residents (and voters), many of whom have served, and continue to this community well. e.g. Christine Munro and Marc Asquith and the authors of the resident's parking proposal.
How can the chairman enter a debate about the legality of resident's right to park in front of their houses? Surely, if we thought we had this legal right then we would be seeking the enforcement of it rather than permission. What we do require is the chance to park either on our street or within the zone for the benifit of residents, including the disabled and mothers with young children and shopping.
It is regretful that apart from one councillor, more of them don't take advantage of this excellent forum to communicate with the wider community which they chose to serve.

Hi,
I was at the Parish Council meeting where Mike lost his temper for a moment or two... be charitable guys, he is doing a lot of work for the parish and we all have the odd 'moment'?

You may know by now that C.East are about to send a letter to residents re. parking and especially re. residents' parking... at this time I simply do not know whether that letter is to go to everyone or only to those residents of streets where residents' parking might come in... this letter should be out within a few weeks... I understand that there will then be a public meeting (Festival Hall probably) where there will (hopefully) be plans/diagrams/colour coding/C.East Officers... so perhaps a chance for residents to 'get at' C.East?

Catriona... the thing about legal rights and parking in front of one's own home was a bit of a red herring that cropped up... we all know it so why it cropped up I don't know... you are so right about parking having become emotive and that we are all frustrated... I so wish someone could come up with a master plan that satisfies everyone (throw in world peace as well?)... the Parish Council is not ignoring anyone; some of the small recent changes e.g. directing traffic to the airport without it going through the village have come about only because the Parish Council nagged away at C.East Officers... as to the lack of speed of action; anything that goes up to C.East has a 'wait factor' that we can do nought about. I have read and re-read the residents' proposal you mention and the parish plan's comments on parking; indeed there is now newly in existence a small group (sub-committee?) of parish plan people and parish councillors to re-examine every traffic/parking proposal in the parish plan with the aim of coming up with a list of achievable aims, in nice clear english, to present to C.East.

One of the things we are doing at the moment is looking at what has been done in Poynton to see if we can cherry-pick some of their ideas... a bunch of parish Councillors have been to see Poynton (no drinkies or nibbles, so not a freebie!) and listen to a presentation of their ideas and shortly the chap who masterminded their scheme is coming to 'walk' our village to then offer us some (free) advice.
Marc... your point 4 is you making a little mischief?

Kriss...as you know, my personal view is that residents' parking should be tried (suck it and see) but there are residents who are opposed to the whole idea (I know 'cos they've told me so). Perhaps C.East's shortly forthcoming consultation will result in them falling on your side of the fence!
Sorry to go on a bit

I am sure I, like others find that alderleyedge.com is the only way of finding out what the Parish are doing. To say that people just Bitch and Complain is just insulting to the people of the village and the owners of the website. Lets not forget that the Parish Councillors are here by default!!! Where do they display the information on what is going on in the village?

If it is http://www.alderleyedge.eu/ then it looks like it hasn't been updated for years as it still says that the by pass is coming!!!.

The Parish Council should embrace alderleyedge.com and use it more as a forum to find out what people want in the village, not just presume and to say that the residents/users of the site just bitch and complain.

There are many issues that need adressing in the village and parking is one. As previously stated in the comments above, the residents are asking for a situation to be addressed and are quite within their right to ask for residents parking to be introduced. In many areas it is difficult for residents to park, due to long term parking by commuters, shoppers and tourists. The purpose of the scheme is to stop this and allow the spaces to be used mainly for the benefit of residents. Obviously subject to consultation by Cheshire East.

Many years ago, I was able to park in front of my house without any problems and take public transport to work without the fear of getting a ticket, until the Council decided to put 1 hour parking on the road. Was I consulted? The answer is no!!!, it just happened.

The residents in my road decided not to attend the meeting as previous discussions with the Parish Council, have just fallen on deaf ears.

Interesting and very valid comments from everyone and yes alderleyedge.com is an invaluable tool about our village - issues, what is going on etc. It makes us a more informed community.

I have to say that this debate is going round in ever increasing circles - hard work and man hours have been put in by key residents of our area who galvanized the residents into thinking about this issue and how to resolve it. As mentioned by Duncan Herald why cannot a trial be carried out and lets see what happens.

Overall I just do not get it - all the debates about this situation are not actually solving or moving forward on any thing. So please can we just get on with it and cut out the bickering !!!!

I am not sure what Duncan is getting at. Why would the residents want to have a go at Cheshire East, when i understand that they have been most accommodating with the meetings that they have had with the residents and it seems that the parish are the ones who have been awkward.

It’s a shame Marc Asquith isn’t on the council anymore. It’s nice to see that he has attended the newly formed parish council for Wilmslow to see how they are getting on with the parking situation and that they are fully behind there residents. Did any of our local councillors attend?
Looking at the Parish website again, i am not sure who is actually on the parish council and what they do. It says on the website that “New instructions from the Information Commissioner’s Office mean that by law we need to make certain information available to the public”

The parish have set up a document “information available from Alderley Edge Parish Council under the Model Publication Scheme (Details as at 1 January 2009)” It shows were you are meant to find information. From what i can see the parish seem to be in breach, but i might be wrong, as i can’t find any of the information that they say can be obtained on the website. i.e minutes of meetings, when the meetings are, who is on the council etc etc, apart from the meeting dates of 2009

If it wasn’t for Alderleyedge.com, none of the residents in the village would have any idea what is going on. Maybe it is time for the Parish council to update and keep their website up to date with what is happening and when meetings are instead of it being 2 plus years out of date.
I understand that many of the councillors volunteer their time, but surely the parish clerk should keep the website up to date.

Hi,

1. the minutes of the Parish Council are (kindly) put on alderleyedge.com AND are in a paper form on the 5-sided structure outside the Coop. There is a list of Parish Councilors (including address and 'phone number) on the 5-sided thing and in the local library. One problem is that the Parish Council does not sufficiently publicise what it does, so it often seems that we do nothing alas e.g. in the parish plan there is a section on the park wherein are listed approx. 11 aims and we've managed to 'do' approx. 5 of them; we hope to do something soon to remedy that lack of publicity.

2. It should be clear by now that the Parish Council has no legal authority whatsoever over Highways, Parking etc. All we can do is go on at Cheshire East, asking them to do things.We have not been awkward. I have been in many meetings with the Cheshire East Officers and they are mostly helpful people but they are constrained by all the laws/regulations which seem to have been designed just to stop things happening! e.g. if you wish to pass a bye-law, it has to go to the relevant Secretary of State to be o.k'ed!

3. There are two ads. in the local paper this week, to obtain both a new Parish Clerk (Kevin is sadly retiring) and a new Festival Hall manager who's job description will hopefully include up-dating the website (which is imho indeed a rubbish website at this time!).

4. As for getting on with it...it is Cheshire East who are intending to write to you, consult with you and have the public meeting in Sept./Oct.. about parking, not the Parish Council. If you get the letter, please reply and if you are invited to the public meeting please come. If it was up to us, there would likely be residents' parking schemes, different parking times etc. already in place.

5. Residents want short parking times (e.g. 1 hour) but Traders want longer parking times (e.g. 2 hours to give shoppers time to spend money)). How can these two views be 'meshed'?

6. Some residents are 'happy' with a fee in a residents' parking scheme but others say it must be free of charge.

7. Good luck to the new Wilmslow Parish Council...give it 6 months and see if they can make it work?

Finally; all the nine Parish Councillors live in/around the village... they are a good cross section of the local rsidents... they go to many meetings; next week there is a meeting every evening (aaggh!)... they all want the best for the village...they get every bit as frustrated as you do.

By the way, Parish Councillors do not get paid and do not claim any expenses and don't go on freebies (we wish!).
Duncan Herald

its nice to see you using the site and keeping us upto date Duncan and letting us know where we can find the information.

It is understood that in the proposal that was put forward to the parish and cheshire east by the residents who would like the introduction of residents parking that they too would like to see longer hours to keep people in the village shopping and had suggested that there be a mixture of residents parking and also the time limit increased to 2 hours to allow people to shop in the village, so i am not sure in what areas the residents are recomending 1 hour Parking.

Just by way of accuracy - I did not attend a Wlmslow PC meeting - it was a meeting between CEC and the residents of a particular cluster of streets who are looking for Residents' Parking - I managed to get into this meeting because my brother happens to be a resident in one of these streets.

However, it was clear that the PC supported their residents fully in pressing for a scheme.

Hi James,
I spend a fair bit of time talking to people in the park (dog walkers) and on London Rd. Some people want 1 hour and some want longer.

A basic question here is that if/when we present our view to Cheshire East, it needs to be a clear and single message... otherwise C.East will just do what they think best (which may not be what we all think best) e.g. should a residents' parking scheme be for 8 - 8 or 8 - 5? and e.g. what provision needs to be made for the availability of parking for non-residents, in the affected streets? I don't know the answers but if we aren't united then we may not get anywhere.

Might you and other readers make your own views known e.g. are you in favour of the suggested plan put forward by Messers Taylorson & Chapman re. Clifton St. & Carlisle St.& Lynton Lane etc.... I'm asking as I live on Horseshoe Lane and we don't have any parking problems so I've no actual experience of what it 'feels' like.

Hi Duncan

Yes i am in favour of the document suggested by Messer’s Taylorson and Chapman. it looks at the areas involved sympathetically, whilst also showing consideration to the local businesses to allow a mixture of residents and visitor parking by increasing the time from 1hr to 2 hours to allow more time for shopping in the village.

I and i am sure other residents who are in the areas involved have no issue of paying the £50 per permit if it allows us to park as long as it is policed properly.

The village as it was put in an earlier posting has more of cafe culture so as to timings, i would be more in favour of 8am to 8pm. Especially as i believe that there are potentially two more restaurants to come into the village at the Clifton street end, one in the old number 15 and if rumours are true a Pizza Express where Tesco are now.

The areas involved can be used as a test case and if other areas in the village require it then it can be rolled out as it is in Wilmslow.

Hi James,
I've always liked the idea of R'permit as a trial... I do wonder whether a public spirited citizen might orchestrate a joint scheme from all the likely streets (don't look at me!)... you might find that some don't like the idea of paying (as in I was told that by the folk who object to payment... only a couple)... the last I heard about the ex-No. 15 was that it would become a piano bar (whatever that is)... there's also a rumour that 'fruitcake' might re-open in one of the empty shops... you sound like a good volunteer to me!

The suggestion of a trial is a non-starter.

The permit scheme requires the drafting and advertising of a legal document called a Traffic Regulation Order. This is advertised for a specified period and any objections then considered by Rod Menlove in his role as portfolio holder. This is an expensive and time consuming process - CEC is never going to do it twice !

As for attending the PC meeting to discuss matters further - let me put my position clearly - I want Resident's Parking for Carlisle St and Lydiat Lane so I can park somewhere close to my house. I support the residents of Clifton St. in their desire to do exactly the same. If my position on this changes I will let the PC know - otherwise they can assume that they know what I want.

Hi Marc,
1. Why should it be 'expensive and time consuming'? The documentation must already exist from former such orders? So dig out an old one and change the date and address? A 10 minute job?
If as we are led to believe, Cllr. menlove is in favour of the permit scheme, then all he has to do is sign the documentation? A 2 minute job?

2. Are you refering to the C.East consultative meeting in Sept./Oct? 'cos that's got nowt to do with the Parish Council. If you are refering to the normal Parish Council meetings... yes we know how much the residents want 'residents' permit schemes' in place 'cos the residents have made that v. clear to us... but we also hear from people who don't want such schemes as they are worried about a possible knock on effect into their streets... as I'm sure you know, from your service as a cllr., there are always two sides to any matter! e.g. in the Parish Plan there is not a majority in favour of Residents Parking Schemes; of 440 respondents, 90 were for residents parking and 76 for residents parking permits and 22 thought that parking in residential areas caused inconvinience, so over 50% either didn't want or didn't consider it important enough to mention/vote for.

4. Don't leave Lynton Lane off the list of those who may want a residents' parking scheme... they get left off too often.

We appear to be going round in circles.
Mike Taylerson's proposal submitted after months of careful research and preparation is first class and I can only implore Cheshire East to re-examine it carefully.
It really is time for ACTIONS NOT WORDS.

I think Councillor Williamson's rather cavalier and ill-judged use of language does a huge disservice to himself and to those who take this matter very seriously. I have no doubt that, as a public servant, he does a great deal of good for the community. However, given the petty nature of his comments, it now appears as though he has a personal agenda. My advice, should he care to receive it: put aside your personal views, absorb the information you have been presented with, think logically, then make the right choice. Oh, and one last thing - engage brain before you make a comment!

As one of the writers of the document for the areas in question, I have read everybody’s comments with interest and refrained from commenting on the matter.

However what we are trying to do is come to a compromise with all aspects of the village from the traders of which I am one and also the residents. We would like to have a mixture of residents and 2 hour parking, to allow people longer to shop and use the facilities within our village. But we are in the hands of Cheshire East who have been most accommodating with all the discussions that we have had with them to date and also in some ways in agreement with our proposal, however it is subject to consultation and if agreed will take a minimum of six months to implement, so is not going to happen over night.

As for areas like Lynton Lane, I cannot comment. Mike and I are happy to discuss with the residents if they would like us to.

We feel that we have a real opportunity to implement a scheme within the village and for Mike and I it would be interesting to get peoples views on how they would like it to work and if they agree with the document that we submitted?

Further to Michael's comments. Our plan was developed from Feb 2010 onwards, as we believe then, as we do now, that we meet the Criteria as outlined in Cheshire East Residents Parking Schemes [feb 2010], partly as a result of "decrim" being introduced approx 5 years ago to the centre of the village, [with no consultation regarding possible displacement!]

The document submitted gave clear facts & figures, based on consultation with residents/ neighbours in the affected streets, where spacial restrictions exist, quite unlike other areas named as possible recipients of displacement [which until it happens is unquantifiable].

Therefore highlighting our acceptance that a public consultation should be part of the process and not just be implemented as previously happened, thus increasing the problem!

As Marc Asquith correctly observes the TRO gives residents & potential areas of displacement the right to express any concerns. However their requirements may be completely different in solving any potential problems [as yet unknown]. To do otherwise is to put the Cart before the Horse!

Our proposal was quite separate to the Parish Plan, but was influenced by it. The % shown in our document clearly identify an escalation of concern within our areas.
The ability of others e.g [Lynton Lane] is not in question, where it comes to dealing with traffic problems that affect them. The solution for them may be different, but if they have issues then they should be addressing them as we are trying to do with ours.

I have great news. CEC have been willing for weeks to start the consultation process and have allocated staff time to take forwards a Resident's Parking Scheme for Carlisle St and Lydiat Lane. ( I think also Clifton Street but I am not 100% on this ). Sadly it has taken Alderley Edge PC nearly 3 weeks to respond to CEC approving the start of a consultation and today at the eleventh hour and 59th minute their approval has finally been given.

I emphasise that this is just to start a consultation with residents who will/may fall under the proposed schemes. If they support it, then a TRO ( see above ) is drafted and is open to everyone to comment. Quite why it has taken so long for the PC to approve this is a mystery to me. I do not think they understand the process and want to consult more widely before we even know if the proposal has support from those who will / may live in the area where the scheme will be effective. Its sad when most of the PC are kept in the dark and just a few have most of the information and keep the decision making in their pockets. It's even worse when those few disappear on holiday and no one is left capable of making a decision. Congratulations today should go the Matthew Lloyd who took the full blast of Asquith Ire at the Bypass naming ceremony this morning and Mary Maczkowiak for picking up the lose ball and running it to a pleasing conclusion. Thanks to both of them for their hard work.

Let's now see what the response to the consultation looks like.

That's great news, Marc. Thank you to all concerned for the hard work and time that has been spent in trying to progress this issue. Hopefully we may enjoy the privelege of being able to park near our houses at some point in the near future!

Thanks Marc for the update - fingers and toes crossed !!!!

By way of the next update - James Howard has been out distributing the consultation letters to households in the various roads. Unhelpfully its in a plain brown envelope boldly marked " This is not a circular" - which makes it look just like exactly that - junk mail.

I would encourage everyone to return their questionnaires asap and also to support a residents' scheme. For those who are on the edges of the area and fear displacement - CEC can include restrictions to keep the all day parkers away from your homes - but please support the scheme - we do not have off road parking and cannot reliably park near to our houses. Thanks

Thanks Marc - got mine - will be duly completing it and sending it back.

Parish Council outline their views on parking

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